From: [f--h--e] at [amd.com] Reply-To: [f--h--e] at [amd.com] Errors-To: [flashlife control] at [amd.com] Subject: Flashlife V2 #8 To: [f--h--e] at [amd.com] From: Carl Rigney (moderator) <[flashlife control] at [amd.com]> Flashlife Tue, 21 May, 1991 Volume 2 : Issue 8 Today's topics: Metahuman priorities detailed (ANANDA) Life Without Mages (P.J.Adam) Mages, magic and moogle-berries (THE MAD HATTER) cybermusic (ANANDA) Weapons and Armor (Jonathan Drummey) System Conversion (Milord) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 7 May 1991 17:37 CDT From: ANANDA%[BSU DECNET] at [MSUS1.BITNET] Subject: Metahuman priorities detailed I've already received questions concerning the "new" metahuman variable priority system, so I figured I'd better give a few more details. Points Race (old sytem) Race (new system #1) Race (new system #2) 0 Human Human Human 1 Human Ork Human 2 Human Elf Human 3 Human Troll Elf or Ork 4 Metahuman Dwarf Dwarf or Troll Here is the detailed rationale for the point rankings: Elf Ork Troll Dwarf +1 Quickness +3 Body +5 Body +1 Body +2 Charisma +2 Strength -1 Quickness -1 Quickness Low-light -1 Charisma +4 Strength +2 Strength -1 Intelligence -2 Charisma* +1 Willpower Low-light -2 Intelligence +2 Body Disease Resistance -1 Willpower Thermographic +1 Reach +1 Dermal Armor* Thermographic +3 Total +3 Total +5 Total +5 Total Considered in this light, elves and orks are fairly equivalent, as are trolls and dwarves. [+2 Body vs. Disease is hardly as good as +2 Body; I'd put Dwarves at 3, not 4, in system #2, and switch them with Trolls in #1, were I to use either. --CDR ] {*One rule I use for trolls: if the troll does not have any dermal bone deposition, then the Charisma modifier is -1 and there is no Dermal Armor.} [ I like that. --CDR ] {Also, since I don't use mandatory allergies for metas, the "+2 on severity roll for allergic reaction" does not come into play.} >[But why do grumpies rank so high?? --CDR] The main reason elves are ranked higher than orks and dwarves are ranked higher than trolls is that elves and dwarves receive fewer minuses to their stats. Another reason is that the goblinized races are not as well-treated/ well-perceived as the UGE races by the predominantly human society. A third reason is the higher cost of living accrued by trolls and orks. [ Cost of living is a pretty minor disad. --CDR] For some strange reason, I've never seen an illustration of a troll without dermal bone deposition, even though the book says it happens "occaisionally" (p. 29). Can anyone tell me where I might find pix of a troll without horns, bone ridges, and other assorted forms of dermal bone deposition? Ananda ananda%[bsu decnet] at [msus1.msus.edu] /ananda%[b--u] at [msus1.msus.edu] \__if the .decnet ananda%[bsu decnet] at [msus1.bitnet] \ananda%[b--u] at [msus1.bitnet] / causes problems a new expression: "4-D." "Duplicate Drek, Different Day." -------------------------- Date: Wed, 8 May 91 16:42:50 BST From: [P J Adam] at [loughborough.ac.uk] Subject: Life Without Mages Howdy there. We just had an absolutely vicious run where two mercs and a decker were hired to get the plans of, then blow up, a Russian fuel refinery. All went well until we were making our escape, when the decker shot my poor elven merc in the back. He made his escape, leaving Hawk and Jaycee to get away from a battallion of enraged Russians with spetznatz samurai support. We fought our way to the airfield, stole a plane and took off through heavy fire - but the plane was boobytrapped and we were brought down in the mountains on the Russian-Iranian border, both badly wounded and short of food. We made it back, just, and are waiting for that treacherous decker to ever show his face in the UCAS again...especially since he was leading the spetznatz guys. Still, if we can get hold of him, he's worth a lot as spares... The point is, we did that run completely without mages and it was a huge improvement. No being knocked down by mana bolts because your party's mage is looking the wrong way, none of the 'eleven bullets in the chest? Zap! Off you go, good as new' instant healing, no astral scouting making good old-fashioned stealth obsolete. It brought a lot of problems (fashion? no, you want a russian uniform, you take it off the guy and hide the bloodstains) but the game balance was much better. I may be incorrigible (my only magical character is saving up for alpha- grade Wired-II because she thinks her Increase Reaction is cheating) but I think magic throws the game out of balance. However, in my game the screamsheets (I put out a one-page screamsheet every week or so to liven up background, feed into adventures etc) are running a series of 'Homicidal Mage Kills 9', 'Wizard Killed by Rioting Mob' etc. stories, because ordinary people just don't like mages. Several talismongers' have been firebombed, a group called Self- Protection Against Mages has sprung up, and generally politicians are finding votes in mage-bashing. That aside, most mages in our group are well-played - the only over- powered one is deliberately downgrading her abilities - but there's so much potential for abuse it's frightening. And dealing with insect spirits - well, the grunts are pretty helpless since we tried to tone down weapons. Magical characters with increased willpower, though... That, as a final point, is a clear sign that magic is overpowered compared to other abilities: almost every character in our campaign has a willpower of 5 or 6, because the mages shut you down in seconds otherwise. My first character had willpower 3, and goinng into a fight becomes frustrating your participation is limited to 'Ready weapon...zzzzzzzzz' as the sleep spells go off. Still, even magic doesn't seem to do too much against a ten-round burst of 10mm meatgrinders from a HK227... ["First Rule: If a mage can't see you he can't hurt you." --CDR] 'Ever see a Fujiwara HE flechette? Hits something hard, it goes off. Hits something soft, like most of you, it goes in, then goes off. Ten seconds later.' 'Why?' 'So you get to think about it.' 'Mona Lisa Overdrive', William Gibson -- P.J.Adam%[uk ac loughborough] at [net.cs.relay] -------------------------- Date: Wed, 8 May 91 23:29:40 BST From: THE MAD HATTER <[D Salzedo] at [loughborough.ac.uk]> Subject: Mages, magic and moogle-berries Again the eternal conflict continues. Is it fair that mages and magic users should become as good as or better than "Real" samurai/grunts/street punks in a knock-down fight? "NO" cry the charcters and players who have dedicated their very existances to the purchsing of the latest in cyber-toe-nail-clippers and field-stripping an assault cannon with their teeth. (Blindfold of course.) "YES" cry the mages, shamens, little funny men in pointy hats and beards as they slap on another spell-lock and warm up the power focus. And the poor, put upon G.M.s? They just sigh and double all the stats on there latest batch of N.P.C. cannon fodder. Well the problem, as I see it, comes from the players attitude towards the game they are playing. In my opinion, all too few players grasp the fact that, although everthing is being done on paper and in their heads, and although the temptation is to make your P.C. the most powerful thing on God's green Earth within the limits of the game system, any good R.P.G. has one aim in mind, apart from amusement and entertainment and giving social retards something to do on a Saturday night. And that is to simulate a reality. As the reality we live in (Well most of us) often seems to dull for our cosmopolitan tastes, we create worlds inhabited by monsters an goblins and, best of all, power, real power, the power over life and death. People all too often make the mistake off comparing the "real" world with that in which they are playing, allowing their pre-conceptions about life to seep through in their actions and decisions. Yes, in the Shadowrun future, mages are poqerful. There's no two ways about it. And the people who have seen all the Arnie movies, and read all the Street Sam. catalogues, and think that a sentient beings' best friend is a mini-gun are sadly mistaken. But, on the other hand, the important note here is that althogh magic is now accesable to anyone with enough mental talent for it, the actual prportion of magic users is a tiny proportion of the whole community. Yes, the world of shady deals and covert operations for quick cash are going to attract more than the average number of magic users than, say, Merchant banking will, the number is still very small. This also means that the non-magic users, particuarly those who have spent their lives devoted to the thought that fast reflexes and a big gun are the solution to any problem are going to be fairly ignorant, if not completly ignorant to the causes, uses and powers of magic. It's no use grunts complaining that the mages are all recting on 30 and throwing too many dice and being to good, if they think about it, in a fight, a non-magic user will have precious little idea what the heck's going on in the mages head. They know, because they hear the player tell the G.M. that their about to unleash a force 6 Power-bolt with 15 dice, but all the other players will actually know is that the magic user twiddled their hands and something blew up. And in the middle of a fire-fight, you have more pressing concerns than who caused it and how unless it's threatening your life. Also, it might be an interesting exersise for all non-magic users to sit down and actually ask themselves what they actually know about magic and it's powers. If they claim to know the names and powers of every spell in the book, ask them how they know it. Few mages go around telling their arcane secrets to mere mundanes, and shamanistic types would probably have great difficulty explaining how they astrally tune in to their totems. Its like asking a decker to describe astral space to someone whose never jacked in to the Matrix. The practical upshot of this in game terms is that, firstly, G.M.s must make an effort to control the numbers of magical types in any campaign. I would presonally suggest institutiing a luck roll, or it's equivalent, to see if any maigical types are available for a particular run. I know that players with only magical charcters may feel this is unfair, but anyone can create a character of any kind fairly fast, and the joy of Role-playing is just that; assuming a role and living it, regardless of whether it's the most powerful being in the Multiverse or just the owner of the Chippie on the corner (Our pal's in the colonies please note, a "chippie" is a British Fish and Chips empourium, a common feature of many towns and villages here) For the unintiated out there, yes it is possible to plan entire runs and campaigns with NO mages whatsoever. I just finshed a run in Russia, where none of that naughty capitlist magic mumbo-jumbo is allowed to desecrate the pure souls of the children of the Revoloution. A good location for non-magical runs. Also I personally would advocate the introduction of willpower/coolness tests for throwing spells during combat. After all, the person who has spent 20 years studying in a Tibetan monastry the innermost secrets of the cosmos will probably have difficulty getting out the right words and gestures in the middle of a gang-war in down-town Seatle on a Saturday night. Such a test would also allow for the chances of fumbles and backfires, and would account for adverse climatical conditions, whether natural (Rain/hail/fog) or man made (Smoke grenades/explosions/loud music). Lastly, I would suggest G.M.s take it upon themselves to check P.C.s backgrounds, and when they say, "Oh well, we'll just call up a couple of mages to help us" ask them why, how do they know what good mages will be and can they trust all that magic mumbo-jumbo over a good, old fashioned cyber-spur? Also make sure P.C.s aren't saying to mages in the group "Right, you hit the left one with a force 4 mana-bolt, the Ram that wall and call up a sprit to protect me whilst I run about shooting things" Very, very few mundanes have that kind of technical knowledge into the workings of magic. Make them ask the mages what they can do to help, which also gives the mages to put across the ole "dark mysterious figures on the edge of your darkest dreams" image by remaining secretive and elusive about their capabilities. Ta ta for now, Aunty Dan. [1. I hate cool checks - its my character and I should decide whether he freezes under fire, not the **** dice. 2. If you call a mage for help, don't be surprised when she calls back the next week and needs *your* help. Heh. :-) 3. I've found the best way to limit mages is through roleplaying; Ratty & Jojo & Koy are powerful, but they don't have the attitude of a razor-guy. 4. Lastly, I'd recommend as an experiment throwing out all combat spells. If mages can't be fire support platforms perhaps they'll have to think instead. At the least, kick them all up a drain level. --CDR] -------------------------- Date: Wed, 15 May 1991 14:03 CDT From: ANANDA%[BSU DECNET] at [MSUS1.BITNET] Subject: cybermusic A couple of questions 'inspired' by my Shadowrun game: 1. What types of music do you think would be popular in a cyberpunkish setting? 2. What types of music would you consider appropriate background music for a cyberpunkish game? (Feel free to give specific examples. :) Please send responses direct to me, and I'll post a summary. [DO NOT MAIL TO THE LIST! Mail Ananda and he'll post a summary. They get this question regularly in alt.cyberpunk; Dance Industrial is a good place to start. --CDR] ananda%[bsu decnet] at [msus1.msus.edu] /ananda%[b--u] at [msus1.msus.edu] \__if the .decnet ananda%[bsu decnet] at [msus1.bitnet] \ananda%[b--u] at [msus1.bitnet] / causes problems "An extraction? From a *hospital*?!?" - Candice Antonelli, reporter "How, uh, 'quiet' does this have to be?" - de Sade, ork merc -------------------------- Date: Thu, 16 May 91 15:50:18 EDT From: [d--ch--n] at [wpi.WPI.EDU] (jonathan) Subject: Weapons and Armor With the discussion both here and on rec.games.frp about the effectiveness of armor in Shadowrun, I figure I'd throw in my 2 cents. Weapons and the defenses against them have been see-sawing versus each other since who-knows-when. The advent of plate armor in the thirteenth and fourteenth centuries, along with destriers, led to men bludgeoning other, their armor so effective that only the impact of the blow did damage. The advent of the english longbow and firearms, which could kill the horse and penetrate the armor, respectively, ended effective personal defense for several hundred years. However, firearm designs have not changed significantly in the past 100 years. Armor, on the other hand, has advanced. The kevlar vests issued in Vietnam promised protection from shell fragments and did reduce damage from slugs. The advances in materials science promise even better substances in the future. So, over the next 60 years, why wouldn't armor reach the point where small slug-throwers can't penetrate, and even the damage from larger ones is hugely reduced? In the Middle Ages, the reasons why everyone wasn't walking around in heavy armor were ones of mass-production. The robotic assembly lines of 2050 could make personal protection affordable for all. Hey, that's just my view... Another whole can of worms is the Shadowrun system's lack of realistic combat. F'r instance, if you're wearing an armor jacket that can shrug off assault rifles with impunity, what happens when someone shoots you in the leg? [ If you want combat that pretends to be realistic play RTG Cyberpunk instead. Ick. I want something that *feels* like a firefight, I don't care if it models one. If you want bullets bouncing like popcorn you can certainly make the tech come out that way, but combats will drag on something awful. No thanks. --CDR ] -- jonathan drummey [d--ch--n] at [wpi.wpi.edu] -------------------------- Date: Mon, 20 May 91 15:09:21 EDT From: [m--lo--d] at [jhunix.hcf.jhu.edu] Subject: System Conversion While involved in another combat, I started toying with the idea of adding a magic system to R. Talsorian's Cyberpunk system. Has anybody converted the magic system, or do I have to make this up myself? (The idea is not based on the slowness of the magic system, but on the slowness of combat...) [ Gee, I'll ask Scott Ruggels if he has any ideas for it. :-) :-) --CDR ] Brian Bankler aka Dreamer P.S. Anybody have a really cool ally/familiar? Hats off to Jonny for successfully summoning his hangover!! Jonny -- "It's great. Now I can run elementals by telemetry." [I hope he got a style point! I like that. --CDR] -------------------------- End of Flashlife **************************